Apostle-ibly?

Norman Grubb made it clear that apostles were just "father level" ministries.Apostles are not church builders as is meant commonly here and in America. We use the term to mean people who can establish structured churches, installing a CEO pastor as head submitting to a "man's apostleship".
Real apostles just reproduce Christ in other believers. Such that they believe and walk in the knowledge that they are Christ as them.
When real apostles establish churches, they "pin" people down in the Spirit to believing that their local church is The Church in that locality, as per Watchman Nee. You can have many local churches in the same area....but ofcourse they will have a different location or street. Their function or calling will be designated by God in every case....but nevertheless they are the Church.

The walk of faith is
- "pinned down"
- is specific.
-Is the Kingdom of heaven fixed covenantally, tethered covenantally to the Earth in the hearts of believers.

Right now, we are Christ going on as individuals.
Right now we are the only one Church going on as a group of believers.

This specificity marked the callings and ministries of Ern Baxter, Ed Miller,and Jorge Pradas.
It is debatable whether the more general leadership in this country is tied down enough in their specificity.

Remember...faith is specific. It is believing the precise thing God says about us. Muzziness
does not work. It's the difference between Portmouth UK mooting the eventual possibility of a monorail round the bay....
and John F Kennedy saying "In 10 years we will have someone on the moon!" Only one of these has taken place!
Dan Bowen was decrying the passing of various "apostolic" leaders from the 70s, wondering who was going to take their place. Somewhat stirred I wrote this in his comment section.

You and I believe totally different about this. You are still at home in teaching houses that call themselves churches. So by that criteria Tony Morton Bryn Jones and Terry Virgo are apostles.

The revelation handed down to us in the scriptures is all we have. So we can only go on what is there and what isn't there.

By virtue of his authority people like St Paul DID DO long teaching sessions to which everyone listened. We know that because someone fell out of the window and had to be brought back to life.

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My first ever post up on Dan's...or anyone's blog- click on The Knowledge London taxi pic above and scroll right down to the middle of the comments section to see the original

Chris said...
A safer view of ministries has been stated by Ed Miller who helped father the 50s Argentine breakthrough, and various subsequent moves. He talks of them as taxi drivers.Taxi drivers to the throne of God. Once they have done their task, they actually have less relevance. The end goal of ministry being to reproduce Christ in others.
03 February, 2008 10:18

Dan Bowen said...
Thanks Chris that is a really helpful view of ministries that I haven't really considered before. "Taxi drivers" to the throne. I like it. Lots. The suggestion then (although you didn't say it) is that it is healthy and fitting for ministries once they have completed their God-given task to step aside and fade into other duties, maybe not so prominent. And then as you say - allow other ministries to step forward and continue leading.

It is an incredibly wise and experienced and brave man I think who can walk in intimacy with God so much that he knows when he has had his time in the limelight and it is now time to walk with God behind the scenes. Such is the "heady wine" of conference platforms and prominence.

Maybe if more ministries could grasp that concept then spiritual casualties would be less.

04 February, 2008 00:47

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So I am not saying that what Bryn,Terry and Tony did is not a part of it. But it is essential that you get around some third levellers, more like Ern himself. because at the moment you describe all these figures as if they are in some way equal. They are not at all equal. You cannot put these three in the same category at all.
All three are more like superwarmed up Baptist preachers and teachers with a human capacity for organising structures like administrators.

An apostle is something in the spirit or nothing at all. He leaves behind him a trail of
self-standing people who themselves reproduce the same Word that they have eaten

I'm sorry, but this is NOT true of Terry, Bryn and Tony.

As a first generation thing of people finding their way in the religious darkness left in its wake by nearly apostate churches throughout Britain, God has honoured them and continues to honour their advances.

But unlike Ern, who himself only skirted around the edges of what his private secretary George Warnock had to share with him about Galations 2:20, Bryn ,Terry and Tony only shared about the early principles of moving in the Spirit.

They have no real clue about the last session Jesus had with the disciples in John13-17.The clearer you see it in the Spirit, the clearer you will understand what has been going on in Britain, and the very real and rebellious cut off that occurred in 1979-80 when Jesus specifically brought in many thirdlevellers to share,
but it was a Kadesh Barnea moment.
At that point The UK closed its heart and became a "closed" wilderness zone...basically frozen in its level of doctrine until things started opening again, interestingly enough, roughly when you made the decision to start your blog.

While i greatly benefit from men of the calibre of Greg Haslam who came here 2 weeks ago, I can tell you really clearly Greg has no clue yet as to the existence of a third level, still preaching as they all do,
adding to your salvation with various activities that are going to make God like you more.

Terry says some great things about grace as you know....but like Greg
that's the edge of what he knows.

Whenever you talk of maturity and authority it seems to be in terms of either the amount of people that fall down at once, or to a human authority thing born of many years study. Well John Stott has tremendous intellectual clarity and authority in his studies, but where was he during the Bible Weeks?
There is only one Melchizedek order which people choose inside of themselves to be a part of or not. This is a unique form of authority which opens and closes doors in the earth. It has nothing to do with tickling the ears of Dan Bowen with yet another insight into the New Testament so he can share it on his blog.

(If you think this is unusually abrupt- I am getting the same treatment from thirdlevellers...if that means anything) End of comment.
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The truth is there are a whole host of third levellers or apostles stacked up ready right now!
You laugh.
They were there in the 40s and 50s. They were there in the 70s and 80s.
And they are there in the wings right now. Like Jesus. Knocking at your door. Patiently. It is you Church that are refusing them entrance. Because of the cost!

John 7.19If anyone is willing to do His will, he will know of the teaching, whether it is of God.... The first step is always being willing.....then the teacher appears!!!!